User mailbox editing

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Do you need this feature?

Yes
96
88%
No
13
12%
 
Total votes: 109

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DFitch
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User mailbox editing

Post by DFitch » 2006-09-16 20:47

That allows the administrator to see messages in the user's
mailboxes. Be nice to see options like copy, move, delete, edit any messages.

D

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Post by ^DooM^ » 2006-09-16 21:38

I like the copy/move and delete idea but I wouldn't like the edit functionality for privacy reasons.

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Post by westdam » 2006-09-17 12:48

yep, i've asked so many times... hehe this function it's usefull.
also possibility to see the imap folders..

byez

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Post by DFitch » 2006-10-27 19:21

Like to see a better directory structure, so we can have the ability to manage mail in folders.

D

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Very usefull

Post by SuperMau » 2006-12-20 05:17

I would love this features plus an email count box besides the size of a mailbox, sometimes my users on slow connections ask me to check their mailbox to see how many messages they have or to see if there is a big message that is taking forever to download (20MB over 33Kbps!). I would love the move functionality too since sometimes I am asked to move all messages from an old user to a new user account.

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Post by DFitch » 2007-02-02 23:01

Martin,

Any plans on making it easier to admin messages within the users folders.

Seems would be a very useful feature.

D

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Post by BA_Dimitris » 2007-02-04 12:46

It sounds good DFitch, but there is always the mail privacy issue, as long it's not violated some of your ideas, I agree, could be usefull.

regards :)
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Post by Dragwyr » 2007-02-12 14:56

This is very similar to the request I made here:
http://www.hmailserver.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7042

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Re: Statistics Manager - User Mailbox Utility

Post by g0yjs0 » 2008-05-22 05:26

I'd like to resurrect this request. I've had need for it at least a half-dozen times in the past month.
Can't we please figure out a way to implement this feature?

Just something that lists the contents (subject line, sender, time stamp, size with an option to delete).

Thanks!
Dwight Porter

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Re: Statistics Manager - User Mailbox Utility

Post by bladerunner » 2008-06-16 12:42

Would a great tool too.
Delete, copy, move and so on.
Not "edit"
but also a "indepth" viewer (e.g. Header) to let administator know reasons for undelivery, virus contents etc

Users do every day mistakes and similia, and calls mail admins (us) to "repair errors" (read: ops just send an email to the Boss I would not....)

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Re: Statistics Manager - User Mailbox Utility

Post by DFitch » 2008-07-25 23:01

Hi Martin,

Any progress with this or something similar for version 5? Not sure how many votes you like but others have been implemented with less. This would give little more flexibility in this area.

Thanks as always for great product!
D
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Re: Statistics Manager - User Mailbox Utility

Post by westdam » 2008-09-26 09:26

yep i agree with dfitch. more statistics would be very useful, not only " just for fun " :P

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by bladerunner » 2009-04-07 23:10

a way to check server status - mbx weight is via a simple query to the db:

select a.accountaddress, count(*) as MessageCount, sum(messagesize) as Size
FROM
hm_messages AS m
Right Outer Join hm_accounts AS a ON m.messageaccountid = a.accountid
WHERE
m.messagesize > 0
group by messageaccountid
order by size desc

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by sysadminus » 2010-04-15 20:06

Sounds GOOD!

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by Bill48105 » 2010-04-24 23:57

If you know the persons password you can just login as them with webmail or other email client & do your stuff & be done. Being able to login as them temporarily (like a true alias account with it's own password to login to another user's box) would solve the issue of not having their password but unless done right you're looking at some potential for security & privacy issues. Of course as the person who can physically log into the server & access the hmail data folder you have access to all the messages in plain text to edit or delete them anyway & I figure most people realize the people running the server have access to their email so I wouldn't be too concerned with what admins can do, more so what doors you open for abuse.

Anyway I agree being able to manage user boxes would be handy but IMO as server admin I have enough methods available to do what I need to do, even if it means asking them their password to login as them to do it or going at the raw mail files if needed.

As far as stats, I am logged in & can use TreeSize or such to see how much space each domain/user is taking up but it could be convenient to see them in the hmail admin although I wouldn't want them updated automatically or as the screens open but rather a button you click on to initiate the scan otherwise you'd be wasting server work & stuck sitting there waiting.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by dzekas » 2010-04-26 12:07

DFitch wrote:That allows the administrator to see messages in the user's
mailboxes. Be nice to see options like copy, move, delete, edit any messages.
http://hmailserver.com/forum/viewtopic. ... w=viewpoll

If IMAP allows use of different authentication and authorization ids in SASL PLAIN, admin can view user's mailbox without knowing user's password.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by martin » 2010-06-27 22:20

Can you guys tell me what you actually need this for? What problem is it that you're trying to solve?

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by Bill48105 » 2010-06-28 00:10

Hey martin,
I can't speak for original poster but for me I think it'd be super handy to be able to 'manage' user mailboxes from the admin for a few reasons:

- For one, you don't want to have to know or reset the user's actual password which is needed to login via IMAP. IMO being logged in as admin should be sufficient to be able to at least list user messages, sort by size/date, delete/redirect messages, edit the EML file, etc. Ideally it'd be simple & fast showing bare minimum needed to help manage mailboxes quickly. Maybe just show from, date, size and maybe subject unless people are concerned with privacy but IMO admin has access to EML files so I'm not super concerned with that.

- Even if we know the user's password many IMAP email clients 'touch' or change flags of the emails (like marking it 'read') and can become very slow with tons of emails. (Think of user who's been spam-bombed & has 100k emails.. Regular email client is going to have a very tough time. Deleting the EML files causes hmail to go nuts creating non delivery notices..) [Reminds me, I'd love to be able to disable those as needed for such instances but that's another thread] So having hmail admin do it *directly* (Database & EML files vs via IMAP or POP) it'd be MUCH more efficient than using email client. And no, not looking to create a full email client.. I envision something along the lines of the mail queue list in the GUI now. Just on the user so you can see his/her email list & do basic functions with those messages. Although odds are it'd be helpful to be able to select multiple messages & do some task with them such as delete or move to another user etc. To me delete is the most important and should be simple to implement.

Hope that clarifies my vision of what would be useful & thanks in advance for even considering such a thing. :)
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by dzekas » 2010-06-28 09:23

Bill48105 wrote: - For one, you don't want to have to know or reset the user's actual password which is needed to login via IMAP.
There is another feature request for that.
Bill48105 wrote: - Even if we know the user's password many IMAP email clients 'touch' or change flags of the emails (like marking it 'read') and can become very slow with tons of emails. (Think of user who's been spam-bombed & has 100k emails.. Regular email client is going to have a very tough time. Deleting the EML files causes hmail to go nuts creating non delivery notices..) [Reminds me, I'd love to be able to disable those as needed for such instances but that's another thread] So having hmail admin do it *directly* (Database & EML files vs via IMAP or POP) it'd be MUCH more efficient than using email client. And no, not looking to create a full email client.. I envision something along the lines of the mail queue list in the GUI now. Just on the user so you can see his/her email list & do basic functions with those messages. Although odds are it'd be helpful to be able to select multiple messages & do some task with them such as delete or move to another user etc. To me delete is the most important and should be simple to implement.

Hope that clarifies my vision of what would be useful & thanks in advance for even considering such a thing. :)
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by ^DooM^ » 2010-06-28 10:49

The way I see this request is if X person is out of office and Y person needs X persons email, admin can just shunt email over Y's account. Similarly admin can check users account if they ring with a problem without requiring user passwords although there are ways around that.
This feature is not an urgent one but would be a nice feature to have "At some point"
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by Bill48105 » 2010-06-28 16:00

dzekas wrote:There is another feature request for that.

All IMAP clients automatically change only one flag. It is not "\Seen". Admin can find sane IMAP client that does not try to list all 100k emails
I said I don't want to have to change a user's password or rely on sniffing unencrypted packets..

I don't want *anything* changed. Mostly for performance but also in case there is need for the user to not be aware anything's been touched.

There is no way any IMAP client can read in 100k messages and allow you to manage them as quickly as hmail could directly.. You have an entire email protocol & TCP/IP traffic in between vs DIRECT file/db access.. Granted someone could make a tool that works the Data folder & corresponding database entries but why not have it in the hmail admin gui?
^DooM^ wrote: This feature is not an urgent one but would be a nice feature to have "At some point"
I guess to me it's more of a priority because hmail's Data folder & database is so 'hands off' and as such hmail should provide a way to safely/easily/quickly manage those messages kind of how File Manager came with early Windows & some form for file/folder management tool comes with every OS since, along with tons of 3rd party tools to do it.

Perhaps it wouldn't be so urgent to me if there was a way to disable certain non delivery notices (like when you delete EML files from a user folder) and if an admin had the ability to login as a user without knowing the users password but still find a 'native' message manager would be ideal. (I say native because hmail essentially has its own file system combining the Data folder with the database entries and as such a native file manager that manages both should be included)
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by dzekas » 2010-06-28 16:27

Bill48105 wrote:
dzekas wrote:There is another feature request for that.

All IMAP clients automatically change only one flag. It is not "\Seen". Admin can find sane IMAP client that does not try to list all 100k emails
I said I don't want to have to change a user's password or rely on sniffing unencrypted packets..
There is a certain SASL PLAIN implementation part, which allows not to ask for password. If support people want to access user mailboxes, SASL PLAIN can allow it. It will be logged and support will be unable to abuse it unnoticed.
Bill48105 wrote: There is no way any IMAP client can read in 100k messages and allow you to manage them as quickly as hmail could directly.. You have an entire email protocol & TCP/IP traffic in between vs DIRECT file/db access.. Granted someone could make a tool that works the Data folder & corresponding database entries but why not have it in the hmail admin gui?
Only if implementation of IMAP is not as good as implementation of GUI. IMAP client can be local. There will be no network traffic. If IMAP client can't handle 100k emails, problem is in IMAP client. If IMAP server can't handle 100k emails, IMAP server must be improved instead of creating custom GUI. Search in standard headers should be as fast in GUI and in IMAP. Full text search will be slow in both cases. Martin should not implement GUI just for admins when any standard email program gives these options.

The only problem that I see in this feature request is that people ask for it in order to be able to violate end users privacy more easily. Now they must wander in hashed data directory and they want to get it on a plate.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by mattg » 2010-06-28 16:42

I had ticked yes, but truly don't remember why.
dzekas wrote:The only problem that I see in this feature request is that people ask for it in order to be able to violate end users privacy more easily. Now they must wander in hashed data directory and they want to get it on a plate.
I tend to agree with Dzekas.

I don't recall that I would have used this feature were it available...
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by Bill48105 » 2010-06-28 16:51

No idea how SASL PLAIN works or if hmail & email clients I use support it..

It is crazy to suggest there is no TCP/IP communication even if you run email client on same computer.. Perhaps you could be picky & focus on 'network' traffic (implying communication out of computer onto a switch) but the point was SOME communication happens even if it's on same computer and that is HUGE overhead that doesn't need to be there for the GUI accessing the EML files & database directly.. (Ok there is still sql traffic but still no IMAP traffic)

Unless email is stored encrypted & impossible for admin (or hacker) to get to, the privacy thing is a fruitless argument.. And I'd never advocate spying on users but they all know & understand sometimes email content needs to be read (or browsed meaning not sitting there reading it word for word but looking at headers or such) by admins for the mail server to function properly or at least monitor & diagnose issues. If the user is truly concerned about privacy let THEM encrypt their emails in the client! Until then I always tells clients to NEVER EVER email anything private or confidential in emails you wouldn't want possibility of someone else seeing.. Their own mail server admin is least of their worries when it comes to privacy..

I'll point out again that if hmail didn't have those silly non delivery notices forced on for so many things (deleting eml files out of user folder) and if hmail provided a way for admin to log in as a user without resetting their password then to me this feature request would plummet super low on my personal priority list..
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by rolaids0 » 2010-07-08 17:17

I'd like to see it list just the Date/Time, Sender (From:), Recipient (To:) and the Subject. I don't see a point in the message body. Then some Delete, Move To (user's folder) etc.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by DeanoX » 2013-06-09 22:15

Can the poll be set, so that we can change our vote?
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by Bill48105 » 2013-06-10 02:08

DeanoX wrote:Can the poll be set, so that we can change our vote?
I was worried it'd reset the poll counts but it didn't luckily. It's all set, re-votes (changing votes) are allowed now.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by DeanoX » 2013-06-10 02:10

Thank you sir.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by percepts » 2013-06-10 02:51

if you want access then you can configure hmail (through ini file settings) to use blowfish password encryption. Then admin has ability to write script to list all users passwords in plain text. i.e. Get your configuration correct and you have access to IMAP without having to ask user for password or changing any code. You may have to reset all passwords if you do this and they are currently in hash form.

So its a little less secure but to get access to those passwords you need to know hmail admin password. So its as secure as admin password is, which may or may not be secure depending on whether you've hard coded it into scripts rather than getting script to ask for it at run time. But basically having IMAP access is acheivable without requesting passwords.

There is also Bills archiving option and mirroring and you could use database replication too where you can do what you like with the data I guess.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by DeanoX » 2013-06-10 02:56

I changed my vote to no. I really do not need such a feature.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by mattg » 2013-06-10 11:02

DeanoX wrote:I changed my vote to no. I really do not need such a feature.
mattg wrote:I had ticked yes, but truly don't remember why.
I've now changed my vote to a 'no' too
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by hottroc » 2017-08-03 22:47

For the reasons similar to Bill and others above I've added my vote as Yes.

However, though I really appreciate the product and the hard work that has gone into it, it's a little disappointing that this has been requested so long ago and still not implemented. I have started looking at it just a few days ago and, with the assistance of other members here, I am making some headway into implementing it on my own system...so why years? I hope to have it working within weeks. Someone who actually knew what they were doing could add this feature in hours.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by jimimaseye » 2017-08-03 23:17

hottroc wrote:it's a little disappointing that this has been requested so long ago and still not implemented.
Implementation isn't actioned just because it was asked for a long time ago, things get implemented based on necessity or being a significant functionality improvement. And to make it a functionality improvement that gets implemented you have to make a successful argument for it that Martin agrees with. (Vote counts do not necessarily mean it's a good idea, only a popular one. Donald Trump, anyone? It's a shame Martin wasn't overseeing the implementing of that American presidency too. :mrgreen: )
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by hottroc » 2017-08-04 11:47

Then, no disrespect, but Martin ought to argue his case against, as others have for. Rather than ask for people's requests, then ignore them with no feedback as to why.

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by mattg » 2017-08-05 00:57

As detailed to you in that other thread - this is clearly illegal in some jurisdictions.

It may not be in yours, but it certain is in some.
Adding something that is likely illegal is unlikely to happen.

I'd like Martin to come and answer you himself, but honestly, he doesn't hang out much any more.
We get security updates (mostly related to OpenSSL changes) but not much else. There is a 64 bit version in ALPHA, but it's been there for well over a year.

Don't expect a response from Martin any time soon.

There is absolutely no problem with you adding this feature to your own build - that's the point of open source software, however with the changes that have happened in the 'privacy' legal space since 2009, I will continue to argue against the inclusion of this into the official builds.

AND you can always use any of Linux MTA variants and do this without much work.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by glue » 2019-05-02 02:10

I'd like something like this, jst able to list all message in the users mailbox, ID and Size, and able to delete
not view or edit etc

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by mattg » 2019-05-02 02:54

On what basis would you delete without viewing?

Also
mattg wrote:
2017-08-05 00:57
this is clearly illegal in some jurisdictions.
Just 'cause I link to a page and say little else doesn't mean I am not being nice.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by glue » 2019-05-02 06:58

not with hmailserver, but i have had where an mail with random characters or unrecognized characters locking up mailboxes and having to delete them via the admin panel so users where able to log back in.
as well as some users running older os, xp etc having issues receiving larger emails and unable to download the file and needing it deleted.

also I don't think it would be illegal as long as the users know the admin as this option, then it would be there choice to use.
I think for a company that is using it, the server is there property as are the emails sent through it not 100% if that has changed now tho

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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by mattg » 2019-05-02 09:15

glue wrote:
2019-05-02 06:58
I think for a company that is using it, the server is there property as are the emails sent through it...
That really depends on where you are.
In Australia you could notify staff of that prior to employment that this is the case, but you wouldn't be able to delete any emails.

In Europe, I doubt that you could assume this at all.
glue wrote:
2019-05-02 06:58
i have had where an mail with random characters or unrecognized characters locking up mailboxes and having to delete them via the admin panel so users where able to log back in.
Install a webmail, and let the user do that themselves
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by SorenR » 2019-05-02 09:18

In Denmark an email marked "private" is regarded legally private regardless of who owns the server it is on.

As a rule the employer can ONLY read your emails IF you have been informed at employment start or during job renegotiation. Tracking calls/emails/mms/sms etc. is only allowed if justified for business purposes... Most of it is actually EU law.
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by jimimaseye » 2019-05-02 14:09

SorenR wrote:
2019-05-02 09:18
In Denmark an email marked "private" is regarded legally private regardless of who owns the server it is on.

As a rule the employer can ONLY read your emails IF you have been informed at employment start or during job renegotiation. Tracking calls/emails/mms/sms etc. is only allowed if justified for business purposes... Most of it is actually EU law.
Also in Italy. Your email inbox is private. Full Stop. Even after you have left employment they are not allowed to look in to your email account by default.
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glue
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Re: User mailbox editing

Post by glue » 2019-05-02 21:16

Did not know that bout the EU or AU

looks like webmail is being installed, didn't even think about that

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